OpenGuides-Dev

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701 discussions

RDF improvements (was: What are people working on?)
by Earle Martin 24 Apr '07

24 Apr '07

Hi Tom, sorry for the slow reply, I've been busy. On 16/03/07, Tom Heath <tom.heath(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > ...It can be summarised as "if your server responds with a 200 range code to a > > URI, it's an information resource; but anything within that resource > > with a fragment identifier is not". > > If I've understood the theory correctly, then yes, this is largely > true and fine if you simply have an RDF document at the URI (in a > document that defines an ontology, for example), but is incorrect if > the information resource is an HTML document (where a fragment > identifier identifies a part of the document, i.e. an information > resource). Therefore we probably shouldn't make that assumption, but > instead say "we don't know what a hash URI identifies". Okay, I guess that's a fair call. > Richard Cyganiak covers this quite nicely I think: > > <snip>If TimBL says that hash URIs always represent concepts, and not > part of documents, then he contradicts RFC 3986 and introduces an > ambiguity that is just as bad as the original "URI crisis" which > httpRange-14 was designed to solve.</snip> > <http://dowhatimean.net/2006/11/content-negotiation-with-hash-uris-long> Hrm. Interesting discussion, thanks for the pointer. I certainly don't agree with that John Black fellow about "claims". RFC 3986 confuses me somewhat, as it says "Fragment identifiers... [allow] an author to specifically identify aspects of an existing resource..." This seems to imply that a fragment only refers to an aspect of a resource, which sounds at odds with fragmentInXML-28 (http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#fragmentInXML-28), which says: "In general, the fragment part of a URI may be used to refer to abstractions as well as syntactic fragments of a representation". Still, it's not really our place to try and resolve this issue here; a perfectly acceptable workaround exists in the form of the 303 redirect proposed by the resolution to httpRange-14. So that's fine, I'm happy. > I prefer slash URIs as I believe they make a clearer > distinction between a thing and a document about a thing (and 303 > redirects help avoid any ambiguity). They also send a stronger message > about a URI of a thing being independent of any one particular > document. Yeah, sure; to a human a pile of line-noise (.?&=%bleah) isn't too clear. Would you prefer example.com/guide/Foo_Bar/rdf or example.com/guide/rdf/Foo_Bar? Also, since those would be the 303 redirects, what would they redirect to? For example, even though it makes no difference at the > machine level, as a human being using > <http://london.randomness.org.uk/wiki.cgi?id=Angel%2C_SE16_4NB;format=rdf#obj> > to identify the pub in a different document would still niggle me a > bit. It just seems the wrong way around; surely the pub is the primary > object, and any particular description of it is secondary? Right. I'm sure we can hash something better out. > > Incidentally, "obj" itself was something I made up after failing to > > find a better alternative to the word "thing", which I have a strong > > dislike for. I'm happy for better suggestions. > > I think it's fine, it follows the Ronseal approach. Would be > interested in hearing you reasons for dislike of "thing", although > you're welcome to save that for a face to face discussion over a beer > sometime if you'd prefer. Aw, no, I just think it sounds kind of weak. I think maybe "a strong aversion" was a little strong, it's more of a niggling dislike. :) > > Sorry? I don't follow... The RDF is completely independent of > > anything; it was hand-composed. Unless you're referring to schemata > > (yay Greek!) that we rely on as modules, rather than Perl modules? > > OK, that's interesting, I hadn't realised that. What I was really > getting at is that (as I understand it) the OG software relies on Perl > modules for generic Wiki functionality (of course I may be totally > wide of the mark here, having never really delved around under the > hood). If that is the case then our ability to redfine the addressing > scheme for OpenGuides and create "pretty URIs" may be limited, as the > modules define the URI syntax. Please clarify things for me if I'm > wrong about this. Right. Well, at present the CGI interface defines the URI syntax, but we control the code, so the format of the URIs is entirely up to us. What can be thought of can be coded. > Just so I follow you, are you wedded to the fragment identifiers > themselves, or simply the distinction between the "object/thing" and > the "document about the object/thing"? Definitely the latter. > > But you could say that; > > alternatively, the wn:Neighborhood item "Rotherhithe" could be given > > an rdfs:isDefinedBy > > rdf:resource="http://london.randomness.org.uk/wiki.cgi?id=Locale_Rotherhithe;format=rdf#o…">. > > Your version is more compact, but doesn't specify that Rotherhithe is > > a wn:Neighborhood, which is an explicit definition that I quite like. > > The more semantics the better I reckon, so saying that it's a > Neighbo(u)rhood would be great. Something like: > > <uriForRotherhithe> foaf:isPrimaryTopicOf <documentAboutRotherhithe> > <uriForRotherhithe> rdf:type wn:Neighborhood > > might be a nice way to express these things (would need to double > check this before commiting it to code); I'm not totally sure of the > semantics of rdfs:isDefinedBy, so not sure if we can make such a > strong claim as <uriForRotherhithe> rdfs:isDefinedBy > <documentAboutRotherhithe> (hence foaf:isPrimaryTopicOf). I'll look into it. > Not necessarily. If <http://wherever.openguides.org/contributors/bob/> > returned a HTTP303 response and a "Location: > http://wherever.openguides.org/contributors/bob/about" header, > (where <http://wherever.openguides.org/contributors/bob/about> was a > document describing Bob) then we'd be doing the right thing aswell. > The # isn't essential. Yep. That's great. Cheers, Earle. -- Earle Martin http://downlode.org/ http://purl.org/net/earlemartin/

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The Tourist Engineer is back
by Rev Simon Rumble 21 Apr '07

21 Apr '07

Hi folks. Thanks to a little help from Kake, my Openguide is back up and running. Kake, I really appreciate it as you made me do the (surprisingly small) tasks required. It's pretty well despammed, I believe, but if you notice anything let me know. I'll have this run for a bit and might soon think about a Sydney Openguide. The sites for this town are really quite lousy. Nothing as good as Beer In The Evening. -- Rev Simon Rumble <simon(a)rumble.net> www.rumble.net "It's the good girls who keep the diaries, the bad girls never have the time." - Tallulah Bankhead

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Domain renewals
by Dominic Hargreaves 20 Apr '07

20 Apr '07

Hi all, For information: I've renewed the following domains for another year recently (well, December; this mail's been kicking around for a while): openguides.org openguides.net openguides.info openguides.eu wiki-toolkit.org To date I have spent GBP101.05 on domain fees for the project -- which is fine and completely my choice. But if you fancy contributing to the project (absolutely no obligation) then you can do so with credit/debit cards at http://www.larted.org.uk/~dom/misc/openguides-donate.html or by bank transfer directly; email me for details. If the payments received exceed the amount I've spent... I'll just renew the domains some more :) Cheers, Dominic. -- Dominic Hargreaves | http://www.larted.org.uk/~dom/ PGP key 5178E2A5 from the.earth.li (keyserver,web,email)

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Paid-for OpenGuides work
by Kake L Pugh 19 Apr '07

19 Apr '07

Just a heads-up to let people know that the job spec for the work Michael Heimbinder recently asked about on this list has now been submitted to jobs.perl.org. He says it should show up on the site very soon! Once it's visible there, I'll post to london.pm to make sure people know about it - unless someone else spots it and gets there first :) London.pm has enough international members that it'll likely percolate quite quickly from there to somewhere more local to Michael. I'm quite excited about this, not only because it'll mean we get to be famous OMG famous, but because I hope it might bring some new blood into the project, which would be fantastic. Michael's asked if he and I could chat on the phone about OpenGuides. He's going to phone me at 4pm BST on Wednesday; I can pass on anything that any of you lot might like to tell or ask him. I'll have my laptop in front of me during the call, so may possibly be grabbable on IRC, but don't rely on it. Kake

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Wiki::Toolkit Unicode error?
by Earle Martin 18 Apr '07

18 Apr '07

Has anyone else encountered this, and/or is able to suggest a fix? [After trying to save a node:] DBD::Pg::st execute failed: ERROR: invalid byte sequence for encoding "UNICODE": 0xa3 at ../lib/Wiki/Toolkit.pm line 895 -- Earle Martin http://downlode.org/ http://purl.org/net/earlemartin/

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Google developer day, 31 May 2007
by Kake L Pugh 15 Apr '07

15 Apr '07

http://www.google.com/events/developerday/index.html I've signed up for the London one. Kake

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Preview above edit box.
by Kake L Pugh 15 Apr '07

15 Apr '07

Any objections to me making the user preference for "put preview above edit box" default to "on"? Kake

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Resources for OpenGuides development
by Kake L Pugh 10 Apr '07

10 Apr '07

An idea that popped into my head earlier today: 16:53 <Kake> OK. Shared del.icio.us account for links and things relevant to openguides development - good idea or bad idea? 16:54 <Kake> I'm thinking a separate account for the same reason I made del.icio.us/kake_food - domain-specific means we can tag with more granularity. 16:54 <Kake> Also because it lets us all add to it. 16:55 <Kake> It makes it easier to have consensus on tags, you don't have to look up the deliciouses of all other openguiders to figure out what tag to use, you just look at the list for the openguides delicious. 16:56 <Kake> This is about 5 minutes' thought, so feedback would be good. Thoughts? Kake

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openguides.org website
by Kake L Pugh 10 Apr '07

10 Apr '07

Hello! I just committed some changes (changeset [1018]) to svn for the openguides.org website, specifically updating the "latest news". What needs to be done to put these changes live? Also, I wanted to suggest a change to the stylesheet, but that's Earle's domain so I didn't want to just commit it without asking. Could we have the line-height increased a bit? Say to 1.3em? See here: http://the.earth.li/~kake/cgi-bin/tmp/ogsite/page and compare: http://openguides.org/ I do think the former is more legible. Kake

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WikiIndex.org
by Kake L Pugh 09 Apr '07

09 Apr '07

Found via AboutUs, a directory of wikis and wiki engines: http://www.wikiindex.org/index.php There's already a page for OpenGuides; I fleshed it out a bit: http://www.wikiindex.org/index.php?title=Category:OpenGuides So far the only OpenGuides installs that have pages of their own are Oxford, Milton Keynes, and the two London ones. Oxford's is a bit bare-bones and could do with some attention. I'll add Vegan Oxford shortly. Kake

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