27 Jan
2005
27 Jan
'05
7:27 p.m.
-- Original Message --
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2005 18:16:49 +0100
From: maximilian attems <maks(a)sternwelten.at>
To: OpenGuides software developers <openguides-dev(a)openguides.org>
Subject: Re: [OpenGuides-Dev] encoding troubles
Reply-To: xlai-feat(a)xemaps.com
On Wed, 26 Jan 2005, IvorW wrote:
What I have in mind is a many to one mapping (or rather a several to one
mapping).
http://mywiki/?café and http://mywiki/?cafe should both reach the same page.
Also,
a link to [[café]] should work, as should a link to [[cafe]]. These indicate
that there is
a single wiki page for café, and that the various ways of expressing it
are translated
into a "normal form" (in computer science speak).
People would be encouraged to use the accented form in page links.
I wonder whether this might be the time to
revisit node_name_to_node_param
and provide something more flexible. I have in mind something inwardly
pluggable that supplies a normalisation function for node names.
what do you mean by "normalisation", it would be cool to support the "äöü" and
others?
I agree :)
Currently, n_n_t_n_p reduces multiple whitespace
to a single space, replaces
spaces with underscores and adds Title Case. There is no reason why this
could not apply de-accenting of letters or
turning umlauts into diphthongs.
I think that there is a strong case for this being a plugin.
please explain diphthongs. i'm not a native speaker and dict doesn't know
it either.
why de-accenting letters?
"café" should well be permitted as category.
café will still work (see above).
This would be an option for someone setting up a guide, whether the
title munging rules included such normalisations.
If there were no normalisations, [[café]] and [[cafe]] point to two different
pages.
The #REDIRECT mechanism is probably sufficient if there were just a few
mappings
needed (as is the case with an English language guide: it would be nice
for [[café]] to work).
Also, this could provide a solution to some of
the King's_cross_st_pancras
problem (I originally raised this as an issue with search, but it could
equally be thought of as a node name munging issue).
see http://openguides.org/mail/openguides-dev/2003-October/000091.html
as i'm not familiar with the openguides code,
i may have misunderstood your statements.
i hope you'll find a solution for this encoding problem. :) 
27 Jan
27 Jan
7:38 p.m.
New subject: [OpenGuides-Dev] encoding troubles
Hi!
On Thu, Jan 27, 2005 at 07:27:21PM +0000, IvorW wrote:
Example: the word f?r can also be written fuer. Sch?n can be written schoen.
I don't know what the German word for a diphthong is, but it means putting
two vowels together.
Diphthong is a german word (too), but AFAIK it only means two regular vowels
put together to form a new sound ('a' and 'u' -> 'au';
'ei', etc)
Encoding Umlaute (or umlauts) by using two vowels IMO doesn't make those two
vowels a diphthong, but I might be wrong (IANALinguist)
--
#!/usr/bin/perl http://domm.zsi.at
for(ref bless{},just'another'perl'hacker){s-:+-$"-g&&print$_.$/}
could not apply de-accenting of letters or turning
umlauts into diphthongs.
I think that there is a strong case for this being a plugin.
please explain diphthongs. 
28 Jan
28 Jan
11:54 a.m.
New subject: [OpenGuides-Dev] encoding troubles
On Thu, 27 Jan 2005, IvorW wrote:
<snipp>
What I have in mind is a many to one mapping (or
rather a several to one
mapping).
http://mywiki/?café and http://mywiki/?cafe should both reach the same page.
Also,
a link to [[café]] should work, as should a link to [[cafe]]. These indicate
that there is
a single wiki page for café, and that the various ways of expressing it
are translated
into a "normal form" (in computer science speak).
that sounds very nice!
i have another many to one mapping in mind (taking local vienna example):
Locales can be Described as "2. Bezirk" or as "Leopoldstadt".
would be cool to have that be the same page.
for shure that has nothing to do with the encoding problem,
but was already discussed for future Vienna.openguides as cool feature.
People would be encouraged to use the accented form in
page links.
thanks a lot for your explanation.
i heavily agree that your proposition gains much better usability
for the average user.
i do wonder why oslo didn't run in any encoding problem,
must check their openguides out.
a++
maks
2:43 p.m.
New subject: [OpenGuides-Dev] encoding troubles
-- Original Message --
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2005 12:54:14 +0100
From: maximilian attems <maks(a)sternwelten.at>
To: OpenGuides software developers <openguides-dev(a)openguides.org>
Subject: Re: [OpenGuides-Dev] encoding troubles
Reply-To: xlai-feat(a)xemaps.com
i have another many to one mapping in mind (taking local vienna example):
Locales can be Described as "2. Bezirk" or as "Leopoldstadt".
would be cool to have that be the same page.
for shure that has nothing to do with the encoding problem,
but was already discussed for future Vienna.openguides as cool feature.
In this case, you could handle this with a redirect.
Create a page "2. Bezirk" which contains the single line
#REDIRECT [[Leopoldstadt]]
Or do it the other way round.
It depends if the two are completely synonymous.
On the London OpenGuide, we have found that there is not a strict correspondence
between ways of classifying locations: borough boundaries, postal districts,
etc.
So, we came up with the concept of locales - supply a place name and allow
the
emergence of wiki editing to arrive at a sensible definition of a place
(locale).
Thus, we have Locale Camden, NW1 and the London Borough or Camden, which
are
three overlapping areas.
___________________________________________________________
Book yourself something to look forward to in 2005.
Cheap flights - http://www.tiscali.co.uk/travel/flights/
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31 Jan
31 Jan
5:11 p.m.
New subject: [OpenGuides-Dev] encoding troubles
On Fri, 28 Jan 2005, IvorW wrote:
In this case, you could handle this with a redirect.
Create a page "2. Bezirk" which contains the single line
#REDIRECT [[Leopoldstadt]]
sounds reasonable, thanks for pointing to that feature.
On the London OpenGuide, we have found that there is
not a strict correspondence
between ways of classifying locations: borough boundaries, postal districts,
etc.
So, we came up with the concept of locales - supply a place name and allow
the
emergence of wiki editing to arrive at a sensible definition of a place
(locale).
while playing around that weekend at vienna.openguide,
i didn't find a listing of the stub pages, the autocreated
category or locales ones, they don't enter the wanted pages,
(perhaps they could be there until first describtion,
don't know if thats sensible?)
they probably exist for the listing. :)
if it would be possible to have that diretly in the page,
aboves would be probably less needed.
Thus, we have Locale Camden, NW1 and the London
Borough or Camden, which
are
three overlapping areas.
ok nice, thanks for your feedback.
nice evening
--
maks
6881
days inactive
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4 comments
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participants (3)
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IvorW -
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Thomas Klausner