I have to back up what Chris says here about the installation process.
From my own recent experience, and maybe by way of
- the apt package works brilliantly on the debian box under my desk
- this box isn't public facing and never will be
- i have several other public facing machines where i can host stuff
- none of them run debian
- even if they did i don't have root access
- even if i did then i wouldn't rush to use cpan to install the
modules - it's always a nightmare and generally fails in my experience
- i'm unlikely to pay for uml hosting just to run the og software
- give up
- forever think "hey it would be cool to set up an open guide; i must
do that sometime"
- never actually do it
This is what happened until Chris offered to host the Milton Keynes guide.
Whatever the pros and cons of the software being written in whatever
language, I think the installation hurdle is too high. A reasonably
competent person with some knowledge and an account on an average
shared server should be able to handle:
- unzipping some files
- editing a config file
- ftping it all to a particular directory on the remote server
- calling a script to configure the database
But that's all we can reasonably expect imho. Sad but true :(
On 12/2/05, Christopher Schmidt <crschmidt(a)crschmidt.net> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 02, 2005 at 05:28:46AM -0500, IvorW
[mailto:email@example.com]On Behalf Of Rev Simon
Sent: 02 December 2005 10:01
Subject: Re: [OGDev] Marketing to OG Admins
On 1/12/2005, "(Christopher Schmidt)" <crschmidt(a)crschmidt.net> wrote:
If there is a way to make it such that OG can
installed by anyone
with FTP and MySQL access
Surely if you want to make it as easy as possible, SQLite would be a
Sorry, SQLite won't scale. Concurrent access and locking is something that SQLite
doesn't do, though it does have transactions and rollback.
In addition to that, MySQL is a relatively minimal requirement these
days, since most packages are PHP/MySQL hosting packages.
What it comes down to for me is that I see OpenGuides suffering because
its written in Perl. I see PHP packages - I'm thinking specifically
here of Drupal - specifically targeting those users who don't have root
accounts, or even the knowledge to run a shell. But they can edit a
config file, and they can use FTP. Drupal has more than 60,000
installations - OpenGuides has fewer than 100, at least as far as
popular/findable ones go.
If there was a way to package OG such that we could give a simple list
of requirements to their host, have them get it installed, and then FTP
upload a single set of files - even if its relatively large - then I
think that we would see increased adoption.
Perl is scary. It has a bad reputation. People don't want to muck with
installing it, most people don't even want to muck with running CPAN.
Huge numbers of people don't have the ability to install Debian packages
- either because they aren't running Debian, or because they don't have
root - and excluding these people as guide admins simply because they
don't want to learn Perl is probably not the best idea if you want
widespread adoption - and I think OpenGuides taking over the world would
be a very good thing indeed.
Maybe I'm overstating the importance that installation has on adoption,
but I think that some things speak for themselves. Drupal has a very
high adoption rate, and is very easy to install. PHP packages in general
get higher adoption rates, and are easier to install. It is my opinion
that the easier something is to install, the more likely someone will
OpenGuides does not make things easy to install. I couldn't install it
without help, and I'm a relatively competent user who is familiar with
CPAN. I can't imagine how anyone could expect that "normal" users could
get an OG setup without significant help - and when something doesn't
work, people don't usually ask for help, they give up.
Open Guide to Boston
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